bad advice and failed dream jobs w/j.d. hillen

full transcript

auto-generated from the audio, so expect a few typos. the audio is the source of truth.

[Music] all right what's going on everybody all right I need to check my LinkedIn because link didn't work yesterday so hold on real quick let me check it and check it what's going on everybody good morning good morning we live I don't see it on my LinkedIn yet I'll see them LinkedIn hold on all right I just got notified that we're live on YouTube if you are watching on LinkedIn please comment I'm waiting I'm just like like before I get into my Spiel all right it looks like it's on my LinkedIn now um for those of you who are tuning in all right we're just

gonna get after it all right we're live we're on LinkedIn all right cool what's going on everybody good morning YouTube's up YouTube Never Fails Dev YouTube Never Fails also Dev um I owe you a text by the way um I promise I will get to it actually just text me again after the show please um because it's it's buried not gonna lie Ricardo good we're on LinkedIn today this is great I love it Colin what's going on man so Colin um Colin's on the show next week we got Colin again on the show next week so I'd have you back on calling um Kevin it's

good to see you Becky it's good to see you so there's your tuning in good morning happy Tuesday very excited linkedin's working I feel very I hated it for Anthony because like Anthony he's just a badass and like LinkedIn like I could I couldn't see the comments so I felt so distant from y'all so it's good to have you all back on LinkedIn I can see your beautiful faces please comment say hey let us know we tune in from again this is a networking event right this is it just it is it is it is what it is like you're gonna show up we're gonna

JD and I are gonna talk about engaging the power of engaging on on social media staying consistent showing up so say hey tell us where you're tuned in from um I I really love when people like tune in from like Africa and like Russia and like overseas and stuff it's kind of crazy to me um the power of the internet um also too ask questions um if something resonates with you JD is an awesome awesome dude um and uh a wealth of knowledge and and he is not billing me for this time uh and so you can ask him any questions away and learn something

um and then uh finally I do want to give a shout out I saw Clark in the comments but that conference the official coffee sponsor of the show right there here we go uh use a code gc2 for a few bucks off your bag of coffee it's really good I promise I'm drinking it right now um actually I I am too this is the last this is the last bottle of mine or bag of mine oh of that of that that conference coffee that's awesome Yep look at us look at that see it's actually it's we're not saying it's so good Clark it's not a

slide at you I'm just saying like typically it's like you buy coffee beans off your buddy and they're like burnt and terrible like Starbucks no this is actually really really good beans so take a look also there's a conference going on in Wisconsin July check it out I'm keynoting you're gonna be there too so so uh so this is a little precursor to that conference in July um cool all right uh let's see here anything else am I forgetting anything want to get you a few more shout outs people tuning in Alice it's good to see you Richie my guy uh Richie move to Atlanta

was the move successful um Clark it's good to see you it's great to see you all so much from the Philip you see we got Zimbabwe this morning Nigeria that's so cool the internet's awesome Mark is going to see another Nigeria I love that um I've got eight bags left before the next Rose hey Clark how are we working on those decaf beans buddy um let's see here is that a Cannibal Corpse t-shirt I don't know I don't know what that is is that is that that is yeah yes it is it is is that is that is that music yeah I'm I'm a die-hard

metal head and okay I've got my stupid t-shirts to find other people so I so I well you found Dev um let me ask you guys so I know there's different types of metal right like that's so mething that like what is your like favorite favorite type of metal um I tend to lean more toward the math and gent metal where they use odd time signatures together [Music] yeah it's it's stuff like I've been a guitar player since I was like 12.

and I can't play any of it I'm no I'm a strictly 4-4 guy and I I think I think that that complex music is just unbelievably cool and and I wish I could play it but I can't yeah same same um let's see here another from Kenya we are international today I love it um awesome and then Richie it's it's it's it's good to know you're in Atlanta big dog I'll definitely hit you up when um when I'm there next bill it's good to see you uh let's see there wasn't Cannibal Corpse in the in the first Ace Ventura we got we got some metal

fans on the show this morning these are my people I love it I love it I love it well I I didn't know I didn't know we had metal fans uh this is why I love bringing on guests so all right JD help me run my mouth let's go to people what they want who are you what do you do we'll go from there all right uh so yeah I'm JD Hillen I'm a developer and speaker and nerd and whatever from Kansas City um I I have three things in my life that I love I love code I love metal and I love coffee um

that's that's kind of what I stick to um I used to be I've worked in all different kinds of Industries a lot of marketing and advertising jobs uh small startups I even worked in the craft beer industry for a little while we'll talk about that later um and uh now I'm working at Garmin which is a GPS and wearables Company but it's so it's so much more than that um they have oh really a really cool really cool tech for airplanes cars um it's fishing I mean like basically they're turning your life into a video game which is super cool um if they can track

it they will um and you know biometric sensors and and all this stuff it's it's it's some really cool Tech um and I work on one of their front end squads we build primarily in view JS uh node and um and uh we do have uh other disciplines at Garmin we're not just strictly view but that's that's my thing I love you I love working in View and teaching about views so um yeah I've been doing this since I was 15 just turned 40 this year so I've been doing this a long time and uh I knew I was lucky I I knew really early

on what I wanted to do with my life and just kind of followed that path well let's let's start let's dive in to following your path in early stage in life right so you know one of the things and again um I I don't I don't have predetermined questions but I do have an automated email that goes out to my guest and and one out of five people answer it and so uh JD thank goodness was one of the few that answered it and and one of the things that we kind of bonded about um or not bonded but talked about it resonated that's the

word uh before we went live was bad advice in college and just College in general so JD I I want to hear your story um which I'm sure is going to resonate with people and then obviously I'll share mine about my dad okay yeah um so I I followed my high school sweetheart to uh to Kansas State University um we've been together since we were 15.

um our 17th wedding anniversary was just a week ago so um I followed it I followed her there and I wanted to pursue something in design um I I thought you know designing websites or applications would be a really fun job um so I went that route um now when I went to college way back in the day um if you wanted to code websites you were automatically in the computer science Industry or the computer science uh group classes if you wanted anything to do with art you were already in the art department and anything else was lumped in with marketing and journalism and really

in my mind it's it's a combination of all three that really need to be taught um but anyway I I started out in design uh took the traditional art classes drawing paintings sculpting all that stuff um and but the t he big thing that I did was I always had a job that pertains something to the industry that I wanted to work in um I worked at a sign shop for about three and a half years making political signs and posters and working with vinyl and paint and um you know it's it was a creative outlet for me um but all all because I wanted

to design and learn more and that there was a time that I knew like over a thousand fonts I can't do that anymore but I used to um you got to be able to pick those out man uh no but no I I got some really bad advice um our senior studio uh director um typical uh art director were all black bald big black thick Rim glasses and had opinions about everything everything um and he he basically told me that if I wanted a successful career that I had to work in advertising and that's it that's the only job that you can work in because

that's the only job that allows you creative freedom that allows you to work on different projects that that allow you to you know flex your creative muscles and I believed him I believed him so after school uh I went on the hunt in marketing and advertising um I worked over the next you know 12 13 years I worked at every Ad Agency in town um and but the thing that he didn't tell me was that the advertising world is very volatile yeah you know uh several several times uh the advertising company that I work for would get a client they would staff up for that

client and then a year later that client would move on and go somewhere else so then they had all these people that were hired specifically for that client and they would lay them all off um so my resume started looking like these little like nine months to a year and a half stints at these companies and it made it look like I was just jumping ship back in the day that was more negative than it is now too I agree I agree it has gotten better but I I got really good at explaining myself of like okay you know this was a contract gig you

know this was a a specific client ta sk um you know I got really good at explaining my history and it actually worked out because the the advertising industry they're they're used to that they they know how the game is played so they they kind of don't bat an eye when they look at it I was like oh you worked at this company and this company you know to be honest yeah it is um the the Turner the turnaround times were tight um but I gotta be honest it was really rewarding working there um and it also made me realize what I don't want in

a job uh you know now that I'm older I've got two kids um they're my life uh I have a family to take care of I want that security I want that stability and that's what I've been working towards over the last few years is is you know something something stable that is um allows me to do the things that I want to do uh but also provides a little security and and uh you know allows me to do this 100 100 I do want to get to a few more comments uh Brady's good to see you we got another cannibal fan uh there's like

three or four of y'all what's up man it's good to see you will uh let's see here just browse the Garmin U.S side the front end is awesome um and then another one so there's five of y'all in there I'm bringing them all in that is crazy never thought guidance counselor 2.0 folks would be metal heads see like I said this is this is why I wear the shirts that I do because if somebody comes up to me and says hey I nice shirt or something like I know for a fact that I I can at least have a conversation with that person and we'll

have something in common exactly you know what I mean it's it's a great Icebreaker um all right so let's let's talk so bad advice real quick and I want to move on because we're already near and halfway through this thing which always happens and so so my dad got some bad advice too right um he in college he was in art and he wanted to be creative and the art Professor basically told him um he'll he will never make it and so what did my dad do he qu it um and then he stopped pursuing his passion so JD I want to ask you especially

for people who are watching who may get a lot of um who may be in a job who's whose job is telling them they're not good at what they do but they feel it or maybe they've gotten bad advice recently from a friend or spouse or a a you know colleague what what is your advice to people who maybe are discouraged right now um my my big thing is balance okay so in my in my opinion and this is you know according to my YouTube Wikipedia research that uh there there are three pillars right there's your personal life there's your family life and there's your

work life um and my only goal throughout the day is to keep those pillars as balanced as possible um I I lucked out I worked for a really great company that that allows that family time if if something comes up you know if I if I have to go pick up my kids something early I can go do that I can do my work later um as long as I get my job done um now same thing with personal life uh I'm I'm a baseball dad so I am on the field with my kids every week uh multiple times a week and a lot a

lot of my personal stuff have kind of Fallen by the wayside for them that's fine that was my choice I had kids um but then also balancing your your family life and and keeping keeping your wife happy keeping your kids happy keeping yourself happy yeah so that's that's really my only goal is to try to keep those things balanced now they're going to get out of whack um you know you're going to focus more on family you're going to focus more on yourself more on work from yeah different seasons exactly um but yeah just trying to keep those balanced is is really my only goal

and uh so my advice to people is you know find out what's important to you you know really sit down write a list make you know come up with the the couple things that you can keep balanced um that are important to you because if you don't do those you're going to be filled with regret and you're gonna grow bitter and you're gonna get resentful um for not being able to do the things that you want to do um you know I'm I'm living proof that you know a mediocre uh developer can get into this industry and make a splash and do something really cool

um but it's it's a lot about drive and it's a lot about balance yeah and I mean even Clark right Clark got bad advice so the guidance counselor told me I would never graduate or amount I mean again I just I listen I want to say this too Clark I I do want to say this the weight of your words matter right and and I mean that for everybody here from being a husband a father a friend a colleague a boss like you gotta remember like your words carry weight and things that you may not think could be something could really really hurt somebody so

having that awareness is huge also that's why my show is literally called not because of this specifically guidance comes with 2.0 but I I do believe guidance counselors gave out a lot of bad advice and so that's why my show is called guidance counselor 2.0 just for the record all right go ahead you got something no that's awesome I I always viewed guidance counselors as like giving you a Mad Libs test like at the end of the day they don't really matter like it's just a bunch of made up stuff it doesn't like yeah and that's why like this show is is is my goal

is really practical tactical advice because I feel like guidance counselors are just all heady and just didn't know what they were doing um all right so the next thing I want to kind of move into with you and again so let's talk about finding your dream job and then realizing that it was not and I think this will raise a lot of people because I think a lot of people think once I get this job I'll feel accomplished or once I get this next notch I'll be Satisfied um and there's that but then there's also maybe some failure in dealing with that failure so can

you talk about your story and then sure talk about how you felt through t hat yeah so uh I want to say early 2010s uh I got really into craft beer um it's either you you're a World War II craft beer or you're a barbecuer yeah no that that is absolutely true um I went I went the I went the craft beer around every time I know I had I had no interest in that but um the the craft beer if you get into that it eventually leads to barbecue or vice versa so especially kids it's oh yeah absolutely um but yeah I got really

into craft beer I was brewing my own beer at home I was growing hops on the side of my house I was building a a brew system uh to do in my base and you know I'm I'm not a heavy drinker like I'll have you know a beer or two every three or four days like it's you know I just I loved the idea of doing something that wasn't on a computer and so I just I just went down this route rabbit hole and then I started thinking there's a there's a brewery here in Kansas City now the Kansas City Brewing scene is is huge

I have a a lot there's a lot of breweries that have opened up that make really great stuff um but there's one in particular that I really fell in love with and that was a Boulevard Brewing Company in Kansas City um they're an iconic uh Kansas City Brewery if you ever get out here love to take you out um they they have uh you know sponsorships all over Kansas City they sponsor the Royals the Chiefs they you know they make specialty Brews for everything um I just really loved uh their branding uh their story and what they were all about and I I told myself

I was like I want to work at this this company now what what does a developer do at a brewery I don't know um but I I wanted to work there so I stocked their website for months months on end and just to see any new job postings and then one day there was a job for a digital media producer and basically what that broke down to was I was in charge of everything that touched the internet that was not social media so our website uh sales portals um uh our Graphics libraries uh prett y much anything that was digital I was in charge of

um and I was like that's my job I want that job so I started basically stalking everybody in the place um I friended tons of people on LinkedIn I messaged people on Twitter um I would send an email at least once a week asking you know just for an interview just for a shot um it but it took me about three months before they finally contacted me back and they're like fine JD Lord have mercy sure we'll give you the interview exactly and I I have no I have no qualms with bothering them like I wanted that job that's my job you got to and

I I bugged them enough and and they gave me a shot and uh you know I the rest was history I worked there for about two and a half years um and there were there were some volatile things going on with the business at the time when I came on um they had just gotten bought out uh by another company um there was a large power grab um but I didn't I didn't really take into account the The Human Side of a job I thought it was just like oh I get to work with beer and I get to work with tech that's perfect but

I didn't take into account the personal relationships that I would need to make and and have to maintain with the people that I worked with um and honestly it was after I got there I found out kind of the hard way it was very clicky very high schooly um you know people that have been there for 10 15 years versus the people that have been there for a year or two um and I I am not a drama guy I am not I don't want to play those games in a work environment I just want to come in do my work have a drink and

then go home that's all I want to do I just want to build cool stuff and uh that was not the case at that job I did not to do that um I was so I was yeah let me interact real quick okay so I'm trying to get on the mental I think because I think you know as I'm in the job search too I mean I think the mental game I think is is some of the hardest part of the job search and I think in your c areer yeah when you took the job you started to get into it you realized it like

what where were you mentally we were like oh no like this was my dream job and now this is crumbling like where were you at mentally uh I was completely blinded I I thought they could do no wrong I because I respected who they were and where their position was in Kansas City um I I didn't realize it until about six months after uh I got laid off along with the entire marketing team um that you know I hadn't been happy there uh it took my wife a conversation with my wife to be like you know were you like think about were you really happy

there you know did you get up every morning and and have a sense of pride in your work and and want to go into the office early no you didn't and and and she was absolutely right but I didn't see it at the time so and when that when that job got lost oh go ahead I'm gonna say this I can't tell you dude how many people I've talked to lately um that have felt that way in their current job and when they got absolutely um yeah it it was a relief um but it took a long time to get there sure I even I

even got told uh I went I went to another interview at a uh a hospital group here in Kansas City after after this Boulevard Gig came came out and apparently during the interview that's all I talked about was how I lost my dream job and the the lady that was interviewing me she even stopped me and she goes you're not ready to take on something else you need you need to deal with the loss of of what you have and and figure out what your next move is and I was like you know what you're you're absolutely right you know I wasn't in a headspace

to to start working for another company and and pour myself into something that I really truly believe in and then just have it yanked out and uh from under me so it yeah it took a long time to kind of process this whole this whole thing luckily uh because of connections and people that I had met through the advertising industry like you talk about networking all the time the advertising industry is all about networking it is all about who you know and uh the previous job that I had to uh to the brewery I took someone else's job that left a guy named Chris now

Chris and I had met over the last couple years uh at like various happy hours and you know social things I wasn't friends with them but I I knew him um and then he ended up moving on to another place where he was like a tech director and uh I saw that he had a job posting so I just reached out to him I'm like hey you know I'm not working at Boulevard anymore uh you know I'm thinking about applying for this what do you think and he's like you absolutely should apply for it so I ended up getting a job right after Boulevard that

kind of Saved My Career uh because I I knew it was a company that I would invest myself in that I trusted um that did make awesome stuff and I wanted to be a part of it so I kind of set aside all that trauma uh from losing a dream job and just like you know what there is no dream job every job has problems every job has ups and downs uh it's there's never a job that's going to be 100 perfect if there was no one would work because that's the dream job right you just do whatever you want right I seriously that that

scene from uh office space where he asked him what he would do with a million dollars I would be Peter and I would do nothing I would just hang out and do nothing um but that that really made me realize that you know there there is no perfect job every job has its downfalls every job has its problems and some of them you can't fix so well why why dwell on that and just move on and do something that you're actually passionate about well and that's and that's for me that's why I've always said I said you need to before you leave you need to

ask yourself is this an industry problem that I'm dealing with that at my current job or is it a company specific problem because I think there's a lot of Industry thin gs like for example the recruiting industry right you're gonna deal with a lot of a lot of politics that come with the recruiting industry every single recruiting job you take right um you know but I am stepping out of the recruiting world too kind of to a certain extent and so it but there's gonna be a new set of challenges right and so right you know with you like in software industry like there is

a set of challenges that come with the software industry in general right so you got to ask yourself before I jump is this an industry problem because if it's an industry problem I would stay because you're probably gonna deal with it in your next spot or is it a manager specific job like current company specific problem right um back back in the early 2000s I worked at an Italian restaurant for about four and a half years uh in high school and part of college and I I have more friends from that job 20 plus years ago because we were all rallied around the fact that

our job sucked and we're just gonna we're gonna get to get through it and we're then we're gonna have fun later that night right and I I see the I see those people you know probably every six months we get together and just hang out and but we all rallied around the fact that this job sucks let's just get it done and then go do something fun and sometimes you have to do that sometimes your job is not glamorous sometimes you're working on uh a bug in your production code for nine straight hours you know and then it turns out it's a semicolon at the

end of the line that you that you missed you know you just feel so defeated and dumb and you know but yeah the the company that you work for needs to realize that you know this this is not a perfect job um but with their culture and the the way the company operates you can you can take those bad situations and turn them good and and turn a a profit and uh and turn it out so that people know that they're cared about I think that's a really big uh a big thing in the t ech world is is just the empathy and because we

do work on computers because we're Behind These screens and on camera for the last you know three years um that human element is really missing in a lot of jobs and and that's one of my goals is to to bring some of that Humanity back to the workplace and um I love that you know just make some friends so there it is so speaking of making friends as we wrap up here let's talk about the power of Twitter in specific because it's kcdc week shout out for everybody who's going to kcdc if you do not know what kcdc is it's a Kansas City Tech conference

I was two I was there two years ago my guy Chris to Mars what's up buddy um talk talk about getting into kcdc and what what you think made the difference okay so um kcbc for the for those that don't know it's the Kansas City developers conference and it's huge um it's I pre pre-covered numbers were easily over 3 000 people um from from my experience um post covet it's it's down but it's still a really big conference um and I've been going for the last several years um but right before the pandemic I I decided that I wanted to do some speaking gigs I

I was running a Meetup Group uh for view here in Kansas City and I wanted to uh start speaking at some of these conferences um and Clark was actually the first guy that I I reached out to he uh he had a YouTube show just called ask that and I reached out to him and I'm like hey you don't know me I don't know you can I come and talk to you online for a little while and he's like yeah sure so um he was really the first one that kind of gave me a chance which is I'll never forget um but but I after

after I started applying to some of these conferences I noticed there's there's a trend that you know there's a certain group of people that kind of talk in a lot of these conferences um now whether that is a sponsored thing or you know a corporate thing I don't know um every every conference is different but you know sponsors usually get spot s to speak and I was coming at it from a spot where like I'm a nobody I I don't I'm not sponsored by Garmin I'm not there promoting Garmin products I just want to talk about some cool nerd stuff that I know uh and

hopefully somebody else uh enjoys it too um so I applied to Casey our the first one I applied to was the view conference which again I'm a big view guy and I got in and I was like holy crap I got in I'm going to speak at this conference and that was my goal last year but I didn't get into kcdc why I don't know maybe my session wasn't good maybe maybe I didn't have the right connections I don't know um but that was my goal for this year was I it doesn't matter what conference I speak at I want to speak at kcbc it's

my hometown conference I wanna I wanna do something for my hometown uh and you know so I I went on Twitter and I found out who runs the conference and I found out who organizes the speech the speakers and I friended some of the speak or a lot of the speakers that I that I've met that that do speak at Casey DC and I'm just you know asking them just hey what's what's your process how do you how do you apply for these how do you you know give your presentation a hook that that makes somebody stand up and notice um and then just basic

interactions you know somebody posts you know something about a tweet about barbecue that they're making and you just throw a little Homer GIF drool uh on there and uh and the rest is history so you you you know you people don't think like people just don't think that works how does that work no it absolutely works the the thing the thing that you have to do is you got to get uh aside yourself and and just put it out there you know it how often do you I mean I'm sure you get DMS and tweets all the time or or you know LinkedIn messages um

I I don't know about you but for me when I get a message like that from a total stranger I'm all in like I wanna I wanna find out who this person is I want to talk to them I want to see you know because you never know where that next connection is Gonna Come From um and I've I've built a career on connections on you know finding new jobs and finding new opportunities uh it's it's been a really great thing and I'm I'm kind of an extrovert anyway um when it when it comes to meeting people but I I think it's been really bad

over the pandemic because you're just so starved for you know any kind of personal relationship that you just got to put yourself out there so um you know don't be weird don't be creepy but you know little joke here and there yeah a little like here and there you know it it it it it does work it does it does all right uh lightning rounds because I got to bounce um here in a minute um writing around three questions first question favorite Kansas City oh that's a loaded question I know it is I'm not a purist I'm not a purist I don't I like I

like specific things at specific places that's fair but that's fair if I if I if I had to P like I like the pulled pork at this place or the ribs at this place um sure I'm I'm a if I had to choose though I am a smoky spicy barbecue guy like if I'm not sweating while eating a rack of ribs I don't want to I don't want it so I I have I choose Gates okay uh Gates Barbecue off of Maine um they yell at you when you walk in it's kind of it's kind of like The Soup Nazi from Seinfeld like you better

know what you want before you get in line and they're they're spicy barbecue sauce is in my opinion best in the city so I'll throw Gates out there is my my choice I think I think when I went with one of my developed friends when I was there I went to slaps slaps the place it's kind of out of town this is good laps is good good they're they're sauce their sauce is a little sweet for me a little sweet but they they their their meat is right on point yeah yeah um uh second question tools or Technologies are trends that you're kind of messing

with or tinkering with right now that you want to share okay um I I've never considered myself a writer um I'm more of an organizer I like I like organizing things labeling things like my favorite tool in my Arsenal is my label maker and yes I have a label on my label maker um so I'm I'm more of an organizer but I've been using chat GPT a lot okay I know everybody's talking about AI everybody's talking about you know generative stuff um I use it as more of a a clarifying tool of just like hey I hey I'm working on a presentation write me an

outline for an hour-long presentation about X Y and Z right and that's your that's your base right that's that's where you start you can't have it write everything for you but it can at least give you structure it can at least give you a direction because I I find um and this is actually part of the reason why I don't really do a lot of design work anymore is that I find blank canvases very daunting and to the point to the point where like I don't even know how to start so I need I need a Kickstarter I need I need some parameters that I

can build around in order to create something cool um so I've I've been using Chad GPD just to get some ideas out and you know just see where it goes now I don't I don't just copy and paste exactly what they write but you know for for ideas and outlines and and you know story lines of of where I can take a presentation that it's really really helpful I love that last question we'll wrap it up here all right um this again this show is called guidance counselor 2.0 right because we had guidance counselors in middle school high school and college that maybe didn't give

the best advice what would be your biggest piece of career advice um so this this kind of relates to a book that I picked up a couple years ago called Atomic habits um there's so many speakers or guests on the show that would mentioned that book I gotta read it I guess James James Clear Atomic habits it is probably the best book I've ever read I mean I've read it I've read it multiple times and it's it's o ne of those things where uh you already know the information right everything in that book you already know uh there's a couple little stories in there that

are interesting but it's just it's hearing it over and over and over again to really make it click in your brain though like oh if I just do a little bit a little bit each day and I'm sure that you found this with your with your Social Media stuff if you do just a little bit a day it adds up and it the the rewards are compounded and and you're gonna get more out of it from from just doing a little bit each day so um the other the other piece of advice that I would throw out there is that there is no one way

into Tech um there it doesn't matter if you go to a boot camp we're self-taught or you know whatever like uh even Garmin for example I applied for a job at Garmin about 10 years ago I interviewed twice and was not qualified for the job at all not job not qualified for it but I interviewed anyway um and then fast forward 10 years I've been working at other places I've been growing my skills um and I applied for a job again and they hire me right away so you know just because it's not happening absolutely right now doesn't mean you're not working toward a goal

always have a goal always be working toward it and if you achieve that goal find a new one and start working toward that I love that awesome well y'all thank you again for hanging out with us today go connect with JD JD are you you're more active on Twitter right uh I I am um but I'm I'm everywhere it's just at jdhillon on every social platform Blue Sky Twitter Mastodon Instagram it's all at jbhillon uh follow me on all the stuff and I'll I'll if you if you like talking about uh View and code and metal bands that I go see then there you go

follow me a few of you all need to link up with JD from the comments all right y'all uh have a great one um tomorrow we are back I have my guy Dan um uh I gotta actually ask him how he pronounces his last name it's kind of a crazy last name de gongi I don't know uh anyways Dan if you're listening I'm sorry uh but Dan was former DocuSign engineering manager now he's at a company called activecampaign so we're gonna talk hang out with him tomorrow um again you all have a great one please go connect with JD and we'll see y'all