career transition into software engineering w/ chris nowicki, eng lead

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Chris, let's get the people what they want. Who are you? What do you do now? And we'll dive in right on. Well, my name is Chris. No, I'm an engineering lead at this dot labs there. I was good to say don't it. That's good to say. Just say it. I just got a little bit of chills. Just, you know, engineering lead at this dot lab. That's so great. Yeah. So this dot labs is a web consulting agency. They do everything from large scale projects to staffing augmentation to training for companies on all different types of tech stacks. Our CEO, Tracy Lee is phenomenal. Just a wonderful, wonderful human being.

Great leadership who care a lot about the development community. And my job here is, it's really cool. It took my, we'll get into my past, but my past experience of leading teams and projects and then taking my newfound passion over the last few years of of web development, software development coding, and it kind of combines both together. Yeah, so I get to, I have a client right now that I'm responsible for. I have a great team at this dot surrounding me as I get adjusted in. I'm about one month in now, one month in a week. So I'm drinking from a fire hose, but I absolutely, absolutely love the job.

I get to lead a project and I get to code as well. as well and both together is just, I'm living the dream. I'm in, I am in a dream job that I've been looking for for a very long time. So I'm beyond excited, man. I love that. That's awesome. All right. So where do you want to start? I mean, this is your show. You know, I want to give back as much practical information as possible. I mean, how'd you do it? I guess I'll start. How'd you do this? Like, yeah, let me start with just kind of how why, why even go into software development?

So in 22, I previous to this dot, I was in, I was with a company called Raytheon for 18 years. So I started off with them as a senior system administrator, training military, how to maintain computer systems, Linux systems, wrote technical documentation, all that sort of stuff. So tech adjacent, right? But as my career changed, they said, Hey, you should be a lead. You should be a lead. And oh, we want to make you a manager of people. And it slowly got to the point in my career with them where I was just managing dollars and not even getting to do anything hands on. And I have a creative, I don't know, my mindset, I consider myself a very creative person.

So if I'm not creating something or getting my hands dirty and then aside from that, I'm just a tech nerd man. I love tech, everything tech. I have gadgets and all these sort of things play with different apps all the time. And so I got to the place where I said, I am unhappy in my role. I talked to my management at my old company. I said, hey, I think my role is changing a little bit. And they said, yeah, we see that. We want you to do more hands-on and nothing really changed. No shade on them. Wonderful company. I was with them for 18 years.

Then I just decided to kind of look into what I did in college software development. Did a coding boot camp. So some people go self-taught. Some people go coding boot camp. I tried self-taught for a little bit and realized my brain needed a little bit more structure. Yes. So I did coding dojo, shout out to coding dojo, great, great bootcamp. I did an intensive six month to stack program where I did about 30 hours a week on top of my day job. So that's where I think I start is I said I jumped into a bootcamp and I committed to straight up just doing it.

I studied. I did all the exercises. Great. cool. So I did that from May of 22 till November, December of 22. And then this is where the trend, this is where the really hard work came in. So you would think that that was the hard work. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, exactly. And that's where I want to start. A lot of people who graduate for bootcamps, this wasn't me per se, but a lot of people go, okay, I'm out of bootcamp, I am ready for a job. You are not, unfortunately.

They get you the technical knowledge, but there's so many other skills that are needed. And I didn't realize that. So going into 2023, I said, all right, what do I need to do? Well, what's this thing called Twitter? Right. So I went on Twitter, I never understood Twitter, what to do with Twitter. So I jumped into Twitter and started following people who were coding. I watched YouTube videos, found them on actually the first person that I found on YouTube was James quick, right? James quick awesome awesome dude found him found him on Twitter started chatting with him on Twitter saw who he followed you talk about this a lot in your and a lot of your talks as well is follow the people that you are inspired by and see what they are following and then follow the people that they are following because those are people that are that are gonna provide value.

So then from there, what happened, was I started working, I was continuing to work on my own projects. I didn't jump framework stacks. I just stuck with React, Next.js, and I said, all right, I'm going all in on this to fully understand. Now, I think a lot of people go, okay, how many stacks can I learn so I can make myself valuable? I think my personal opinion is if you go in and you're like, all right, I'm brand new, I'm self-taught and I'm gonna put on my resume. I know the Python stack, I know next JS stack, I know larval stack. That's actually gonna hurt you because if you don't have a ton of projects to show for that, knowing more does not mean you are valuable, knowing a lot of one does.

And this transitioned into my career at this dot and I'll talk about that in a little bit. So from there, I heard about this thing called render Atlanta. Like what is render Atlanta? I was in, I was looking for maybe are there meetups or something I can go to. James Quick had a 20% discount. I sent him a DM connected with him. And I decided to go all in, man. I bought a VIP ticket like two weeks before the conference. So like I went all in. I'm like, all right, I'm gonna get a VIP ticket. Went to the VIP event, met James who introduced me to a ton of people.

And then that's how everything kind of took off from there. I said, oh, there's something here talking with all these individuals. And I was talking with people. I was in the VIP rooms. I met Nate Codes. I met so many different people. I heard about this group called Virtual Coffee that Becca runs. And I said, oh, I want to get involved in that. So I got connected with Virtual Coffee. And then from there, I said, okay, I started getting connected with people, getting involved in the community. And what does that look like? Well, that was more of getting involved on Twitter, seeing what people are doing on Twitter, commenting on what people are doing on Twitter, not just for someone to see, hey, who is this Chris guy, but I wanted to provide value as well somehow, right?

And from there it transitioned to, all right, what's the next thing I can get involved in? And I just started looking around. I started looking around, I started talking some more to people, stayed in contact with James, started making more connections through virtual coffee. The virtual coffee community, I actually started volunteering with. So I became a MC, MCing, they're biweekly, whenever I could maybe once a week, was a note taker, help let breakout rooms. And that didn't connect me with anything necessarily to my current role, but what it did was connect me with other like-minded individuals who were pursuing a, either they were laid off looking for their next role or they were like me who were going, I want to look for my first job in tech.

And that gave me a space just to feel comfortable, uh, uh, uh, airing my frustrations, airing my, my, because I started to cold-applying to jobs, right? Around this time, I'm like, all right, you know what? Let's just see what's out there. I applied for maybe 300 plus roles and nothing. Yeah. Not even a rejection. Sometimes I got the automated ones, right? But nothing and I'm going, all right, this is not gonna work. And this is also when the 2023 was when the whole environment change for those pursuing tech, right? That's when tech layoffs were at their high in 2023. Yeah. I know you talked about this as a recruiter.

That's when things shifted from a recruiting standpoint as well. The strategy for job seekers switched. To fast forward this a little bit, then people can ask a lot of questions. I heard about this, I see Clark Cell in here. Yeah, I was thinking this a lot. Yeah, yeah. Clark Cell, shout out to you, man, because I tell you, I love Render ATL, great community. It's a whole different vibe than what that conference offers, which is a great community that Clark has built. And I went to that conference in Texas in January. And little did I know, you know, I got a free ticket to go from Danny Thompson, who is now a coworker of mine, which is just freaking a mind blown to be a coworker with Danny, you know, it's just nuts.

So I go there and I meet a ton of people. I meet Tessa Creasel. I meet the other Tessa from Appright. I meet, I saw you there, we got to connect a little bit more. And so my strategy at that conference was, what can I do to move myself to that next level to get seen and to show my value? Yeah. And something interesting that came from that conference was two things. One, just talking with individuals, I had a really interesting conversation at a table with Shashi Lowe, with Brad Garopi. I probably botched that name, I'm sorry, Brad. But we're at the barbecue night talking about everything.

And later on, we're at the Bonfire Chat and you go, so who do you work for? I said, I'm looking for my first role and he goes, I don't understand. Because you talk like you know what you're talking about. I knew I told Ryan that this past week, commit your code. Ryan Fur, right? Yep. Dude, Ryan Fur, good, good close friend of mine. Yeah. I completely agree. He knows a ton. And so I'm going, okay, what I'm speaking and just naturally talking about people are resonating with. Cool. So then I go up to James quick. And I remember James quick being on his podcast and he's saying, hey, I would love for people to offer to help, but a lot of people don't.

And I said, why don't I just go up and talk to him? So I said, hey, James. I would love to help you out for a little bit. Is there something that I can help you with? I'm not looking for compensation. I just wanna work on a real project that is not a side project that is not going anywhere. Something that is going to be used. And he was working on deals for devs at the time. That project he had just launched the Black Friday of 2022 or 2023. And he goes, yeah, so we sat down and we talked for an hour and he goes, dude, okay.

He goes, first of all, after talking with you for an hour, you seem to really know your crap about next JS. I'm like, yeah, I love it. And here's all the things that I've done. He goes, the things that you've done, I would love your help with. I said, sure. So I jumped in, helped him out, which motivated him to get going, to get that project going up again. But then here's where the networking comes in as well. Through that conference, Shashi Lowe, he came up to me, he goes, hey Tyler. My name is Chris, man. He just kept on call me Tyler, and I let him call me Tyler.

And it was great. He reaches out to me, I get involved in Discord, I get invited by him to his channel and a few other things and I was in another channel with a few others and he goes, hey Chris, can I reach out and talk to you? I said, sure. And he goes, I'm starting a cohort of like-minded individuals like you who are trying to break into tech and I wanna run it like we do at Microsoft. So we're gonna run up a full up team and would you wanna be one of our backend engineers on this team? And as we get it started and I said, absolutely.

And this is where things really took off. Because this is this, I talked about this this past year at Render ATL, Jason Torres and I both talked about this. I'm so tired of things. Of bridging the gap, right? And this is where I'm gonna tie it back to bootcamp to something that actually is tangible. working in a team, understanding how to communicate in a team, understanding how to code with the team, understanding how to resolve, you know, multiple people are working in multiple branches, how to resolve merge conflicts, how to talk about what you're doing, what you need help with, are you blocked by someone reaching out to them?

Or, hey, I'm not even gonna be around this week to work on anything, I got other stuff going on, right? That stepped up my game a ton to be able to talk about working with the team and understanding how to work with the team. Yeah. So fast forward real quick. We're at that conference Wisconsin. My first CFP that I was accepted for, I talked about mental health and productivity for developers. Rob Ocel was at, I'm sorry if I'm watching these names. Rob, he's one of the VPs. He's the VP of innovation at this. He was at one of my talks. And we resonated, we talked a lot.

Tracy and I were on the same plane going back to Atlanta. And my wife and I helped her, helper and her family load on their kids and all their luggage. And it was hilarious. But Tracy goes, hey, you should reach out to Rob and just ask them to do their coding challenge, not as an interview, not as an application, just to see where you're at. And I said, all right, so I reached out to Rob. And I said, hey, Rob. I said, can I take the coding challenge? He goes, yeah, sure. So we connected. He gave me the coding challenge. He goes, we're really taking the time limit away, but normally we get people four to six hours to create an app based on these criteria.

Submit it in a private repo. That way, other interviewees don't get access to it. I did it, submitted to him. We had an hour and a half conversation. And he goes, Chris, he goes, you, I have nothing but nitpicky things to say about the app that you built. So the app wasn't supposed to be perfect and design. Really, they wanted you to focus on more of the functionality in the code. So we talked for an hour and a half. We went detailed by detail. I mean, he took the time for free to meet with me all because I asked and to walk through my code saying what I could have done better, what I did well, and the things that stood out and the things that I could do to make myself stand out.

He is also from the defense. Way back in the day, he worked contracts and defense. So we kind of connect him on that level as well. And I said, I want to be a developer. He goes, yeah. He goes, I get that. He goes, really at this thought, they hire a lot of senior devs. They do some junior stuff here and there for apprenticeships. But I didn't come as a junior. I didn't come in as a senior. I was somewhere in the middle, right? But I have all of this experience as a lead. He goes, we've really been having a hard time trying to fill a role for an engineering lead.

Tracy and I had been talking about this. Would you be interested in pursuing this? I said, you know, let me think about it. I took a step back because I just wanted to code. That's all I wanted to do. I didn't even have leading teams on my radar. I just wanted to code. I just wanted to write code all day. Long story short, I ended up interviewing a couple weeks later, got contacted saying, hey, we're really interested in you, let's start talking through it. I interviewed with the CTO, with Tracy, with two of the other VPs, had a great hour-long conversation, and that ended up leading me to this role where I realized, even in the negotiation process, the CTO, Elliot, it goes, Chris, you know, I know that Tracy knows you and Rob knows you, we're not doing this as a favor to you.

We actually see value. You are a great fit for our culture. You are, you know, we understand that you're newer in the development world, but you have all of this extra experience. And I realized that yes, I can still take these transferable skills, still be a lead and not be necessarily responsible for people, because that's That's what I didn't want to do. I did not want to be a manager of people. But projects, sure. And I geek out over this stuff. So within the first three weeks at this dot, learning my client, I'm diving into their structure, their dev environments, how everything is put together, geeking out over it to where the customer even said, hey, Chris, we've never seen someone get spun up so quickly on our platform.

And that's just because I geeked out over it, you know? So that's kind of, I probably missed some stuff in there, but that I know we only have a half hour and we've got 10 minutes left or so. So that's the- Man, that's so good. I mean, if you guys have questions, please ask. Well, I'll kind of hate you with some Q&A right now. The chat has just been nuts. Chris brings out the people for sure. Eva comes in here, it's good to see you Eva. It's gotten a lot harder transition between roles like Devin Lee. Everyone wants to hire you the same thing you did five minutes ago?

Yeah, I mean, it's definitely, definitely something like you. Absolutely. Hey Chris, How do you work on, I'm assuming it's taming scope creep in a leadership role? Oh, that's a great question. So yeah, definitely an elite. You definitely have to look at scope creep. I think the first important thing is just looking at what are we, what are you on contract to do? What does that look like? Yeah. Right now where I am at my first three weeks, I haven't had to work with a lot of scope creep. However, the conversation does come up internally. And we are keeping an eye on that with our senior architects who are heavily involved as well.

So that's the other thing about this, Dot, that's great. It's not just, okay, here you go. Their leadership is involved in all the projects. So I'm doing biweekly check-ins with my management on what's going on with the project. They want to be involved in the architect of the project. But yeah, I think scope creep is something that's really easy. It's all about communication and understanding what are the risks. And I think scope creep comes down to risk mitigation, looking ahead to what do you think is going to cause a scope creep? How can we mitigate that and how can we continue communication with the clients that they understand what's happening technically?

What's happening in the overall bigger picture? Um, I want to go back to the job search real quick. Yeah. And again, like, uh, you know, I know there's a lot of questions going on. And, and, um, you know, actually, Jason, I know you're watching this. We need to get everybody into the torque discord to continue to chat after the live. So Jason, if you're watching this, let's make that happen, please. So if I were to recap what you just said with your, with your story, how you got job in tech, go to meetups, go to conferences, be engaged, maybe offer up your services for free.

Yep. Am I saying? No, I think, I think that's pretty much it. don't be afraid to get involved, get engaged. It's if you're just sitting at home. I look, developers, we're all different. We're all different. We're special kind of people, right? A lot of us are introverts. And a lot of us are afraid to put ourselves out there. But if you are in a position of looking for your first role in tech and you are one of those people, I encourage you, get on LinkedIn, start posting what build in public, build in public, build in public, build in public. I don't want to become a Mr.

Beast. I feel like you say Bill in public, and everyone's like, I don't want to become a content creator. You don't have to be a content creator. It's what are you learning? And I've had a lot of conversations with people about this. So okay, you maybe don't want to do a live stream or go on Twitch or do anything with that be an influencer. That's not at all what I'm saying. What I'm saying is a lot of people go, I am learning, let's just say it's next JS. I'm learning next JS for the first time. Okay, cool, what are you learning? What did you learn today?

Write a blog post about it. Because there's someone out there in your position who is looking for content. And just because a whole bunch of other people have written content on it doesn't mean that you don't have a value to put out there for others to consume. And it's not about getting the likes, it's not about getting the follows. When you actually write about what you're learning, you retain the information more. And you're putting it out there. And you can post progress on what you're doing. That is when you don't have a job in tech and you don't have it on your resume to show, you're building public, a lot of times they might say, hey, attach some articles you wrote.

Boom. Now you got a bunch of technical articles that you wrote while you were learning something and they can see your learning process. I jumped into this dot, I haven't experienced with Next.js, the client that I'm working with, the front end is Next.js and the back end is PHP. I've never done PHP in my entire life. But now I'm doing PHP. but I can actually transfer what I know from JavaScript to PHP, it's just learning the syntax, but I know data structures, right? Right. Dominic comes in here and goes, hey Chris, would you be able to, would you say you fill your role at this dot has more similarities in form and function to GIS or previous job in defense?

He's talking about Gridiron's survivor, the Shashi Low Project cohort. So Dominic is one of the many who are in Shashi Low's cohort. I would say the job is a mixture of both. When I was in gridiron survivor, I was helping the team out from a technical perspective, helping with the architect, helping Shashi with the architect of the app and doing a lot of the back end stuff. And then it's between that and then my leadership skills that I've built up over 18 years at Raytheon in defense. So it was a mixture of both. Yeah, I love it. I love it. Let's see here get into the questions.

There's almost already at time. Yeah, I wanna give a shout out to Barrett too, man. I mean, he's a, I see you, I see you, right? Even if people, you gotta say something, even if you don't get the likes in the comments, people see you, right? Like I was in my talk, when I gave my talk to commit your code, Ryan Furrier was in my talk. I gave him a shout out about his F1 Mercedes page he did. And like he was like, holy, I mean, I could tell like he was like, oh wow. Like people watch you, even if you don't comment or like it.

So just keep putting stuff out, man. Keep putting stuff out. Let me tell you something. I wrote an article on how to secure on how to do a cron job in Vercel. Just cause I wanted to write an article about it. I was learning about it. And then I updated the article cause something was updated and changed. That article found itself into one of the GitHub comments on Vercel's page to where my article was the response for the fix to the solution. And that, I don't have any views at all. I'm gonna do it right now. I'm gonna do it on this. I'm literally do it on the stream I'm gonna message Aaron Francis and get him to come back on the show to talk about His talk I commit your code Did you talk about building in public?

Yes. Yeah I'm gonna text him right now Do it he has a great I am the biggest Aaron Francis fanboy way. Easily. So I bought his course on how to read more. Also, Tessa, I need to, I'm messaging you now to Tessa because I need to get you. It's been too long. It's been too long. Tessa's awesome. Yeah, Tessa, I'm messaging you. Please sign up. Thanks. Yeah, incredible. So, man, as we wrap up here, any words of encouragement, I mean, listen, like, I mean, I would say you probably found a job in like the hardest. I mean, one of the most difficult markets right now, I mean, so like, what would you tell people?

Don't be afraid to put yourself out there. Don't be afraid to ask if you can get involved in a project. No creator that you look up to is not accessible. That's, that's not. Yeah, yeah. That's not reachable. like reach out, like Taylor encourages you, reach out to him. I mean, I messaged you on Twitter a couple times and you responded and messaged other people. Yeah, my response rate is like 30 days later, just FYI. But like, listen, there was one time when I reached out, I just messaged the VP of, Lee Rob, the VP of, next day of dev experience at, at next JS for sale.

He responded the next day and we had a great conversation. Like it, I mean, no one is out of reach to talk to, to ask for advice, to ask for help, put yourself out there, build them public, research, you know, again, not influencer, but what we talked about, go to conferences, go to local meetups, go to local meetups. You never know what you're gonna find your little meetups. Like I think we need to free frame our wording here is like either start a meetup or go to a meetup. But I think I, like a lot of meetups have died out. Yeah. And so start something.

Yeah. Start something. Start something. It's not there. Start meetup.com. Start a local coffee and code meetup. You know, I'm going to plug guild. I'm going to plug guild. Host instead because it's free to start a meetup. You got to pay on meetup.com to be a meetup host. Guild.host. Do it. Dot host. I'm going to put it here. If my buddy has to sing. Uh, he created a competitor. And we use it at Torque. I use it for my dad's in Tech Group too, and it's free to use. The only people that pay is sponsors. So use Go. But what Chris said, just start something. Just start, stop sitting on your ass.

Stop sitting on your ass. Just go start something. Get out there, do something, start something. Talk to people, go to conferences, say who you are. You'll get there eventually. You will, you will land your job. Persevere, you will do it. but you can't sit on your hands. No, you gotta do, you gotta actively get and do something. Don't just sit there, put yourself out there. Absolutely, cool. Tampa keeps him coming from there. Yeah, yeah, Tampa's got a lot. Go ahead and up Jacqueline if you're in the Tampa area. Cool. All right, Chris, rapid fire, the comments, this is nuts, I've never seen the comments section like this.

So Chris brings out again, the power of community. Chris is out there, Chris obviously, I'm a big fan of you, I followed you. Chris is doing the damn thing. Do just do the damn thing. Do the damn thing. Do the damn thing. Hey, reach out to me. If you're in there, if you're out there and you find me on Twitter at IAMWix, reach out to me on LinkedIn, I will respond. I would love to connect with you. Absolutely. Rapid Fire here, if I told you you could not wake up tomorrow morning and be in tech, you just got your job in tech. But I told you you couldn't do anything in tech anymore.

What would you do for your job? And I'd pay you the same if not more. Oh my gosh, I would become a master barbecue smoker. I love smoking. Yes, I love smoking ribs and brisket. I'm smoking some pork, some pork belly for the meetup tomorrow in Atlanta for the JavaScript meetup. So I'm looking forward to it. I love that. That's awesome. Second question, obviously, this the first question kind of answered the second question, but what else do you like to do outside of work on smoke meat? Oh my gosh. I want to get into mountain biking. So something I've I've been fell out of and I want to get back into.

Shashi showed up. What up big guy? Low and slow barbecue. Yeah, listen, I just tinker with all things techs. Well, I'm not actually coding. I am watching YouTube on the next tech stuff, trying to figure out my productivity, playing with apps. I just, I'm a geek man. That's what I do. Yeah. Yeah. I love it. Third question, have you done, so this is kind of a tech nerdy type stuff. anything you've been developing with, or coding with, tinkering with on the side, or even in production that you're really, that's kind of new and exciting that you're pretty pumped about? Yeah, I've been playing around with Vercel's AI SDK, which is pretty, pretty phenomenal to be able to easily tie into multiple AI frameworks.

So that's just something I've been playing with on the side and I absolutely, I think it's so much fun and so easy to work with. I love that, I love that. Best meat to smoke. It depends, man. I'm going to say the easiest week to smoke. You can't go wrong with this good pork, but brisket's one of my favorites. There you go. Last question as you wrap up here again, thanks for everybody's tuning in. We're continuing the chat in the TORT Discord, so come hang out with us if you want to. So we had guidance counselors, so it shows called guidance counselor 2.0. We had guidance counselors middle school, high school and college, but now as adults, we don't really have anybody to turn to and ask for career advice.

That's why I do the show. It's just general career advising tech. What would be your biggest, like if you could go back to younger Chris, like young Chris, what would you say? Like what career advice would you tell him? I would tell him to get involved. If I could have gone back, I would have gone all in on software engineering and software development because I love it. If I knew what I knew today, I mean, Yes, my experience at 18 years at Raytheon, I could transition a lot of stuff over, but man, I wish I would have gotten involved a lot sooner. So I would have told myself go all in on computer science, software engineering much earlier.

I love it, man. We got Anthony Maison in the chat. Dude, I love that guy. I'm really buddy in the chat today. I love it. I love it. Also, Jason's going live today with Tech Commute at Gantt with Gantt. Lord have mercy. You need to get some sleep, bro. Words are hard. I'm full of words. I'm smart, so I'll voice this point. Yeah, so go hang out with Jason. Gance always a, Gance always a character. So definitely go hang out with him. Cool. All right, y'all. Well, Chris, thank you, my friends. Stay on. Thank you. I'll be back stage. Go connect with Chris. Shut up this dot labs.

Tracy was actually texting me last night about some things. So appreciate her. Appreciate this dot labs. This dot and torque did a cross collaboration for the speaker dinner. Happy hour at commit your code. That was a blast. But again, we're in the discord right now. Chris wants to pop in, pop in, but otherwise y'all have a great one and we'll see y'all tomorrow. So tomorrow, real quick episodes this week. My guy Hank Washington, who is the designer for Render ATL. He is coming on the show tomorrow, runs his own business, going to talk with him about running his own business. And then Thursday, I'm super pumped about of another, I have two Hanks this week.

Hank Taylor, who is now I believe the CMO of of Laravel. Hank is coming on the show on Thursday, going to talk about developer marketing. So that's going to be a blast. So y'all have a good one. We will see y'all tomorrow. Go hang out with Jason this afternoon with Gantt. Hey, you did it. You listened to an entire episode and I am very grateful because you know why? There's a lot of podcasts out there. There's a lot of episodes and I myself rarely finish an entire episode. So I appreciate you so, so much for listening. Quick reminder, please rate and review this podcast in the App Store.

I want this to be discoverable to others. And the only way that happens is if you take the time right now and rate and review it, please like right now, unless you're driving, then don't do it. So thank you again. If you need to reach out to me at Tdaston on all social media handles. And I hope you have a fantastic day.